Rick steves europe best 2 months itinerary?

[styrx]

Anyone tried out rick steve 2 months trip, in his europe through the backdoor book? i have left out those scandanavia countries. I am looking at doing this for my 3-4 months trip, which will include some eastern europe countries. Please comment.

london-5 days
paris-3 days
loire valley- 2 days
madrid- 2 days
toledo- 1 day
lisbon-2 days
algrave- 2 days
sevilla and andalucia- 3 days
barcelona- 2 days
provence- 2 days
cinque terre- 2 days
florence- 2 days
tuscany- 2 days
rome- 3 days
venice- 2 days
vienna- 2 days
prague- 2 days
salzburg- 1 day
tirol and bavaria- 2 days
switzerland- 3 days
munich- 2 days
romantic road- 1 day
rhine river- 2 days
berlin- 2 days
amsterdam- 3 days

[herrbert]

Hi Styrx,

As far as the cities are concerned it's a good plan, although I would make sure to make some destinations more precise (Andalusia is a place where you can spend 14 days without a problem), and quite a lot of these towns deserve a longer stay.

Also I have a couple of questions about the transportation. There are a couple of long stretches in your plan (like Loire Valley - Madrid and Barcelona - Provence, take a long time if you want to do them by train).

london-5 days
paris-3 days (4-5 days, daytrip Versailles?)
loire valley- 2 days
madrid- 2 days (3-4 days daytrip to Toledo)
toledo- 1 day (as a daytrip it's easier)
lisbon-2 days (3 days - check flight and train to get to Lisbon, if you go by train and you have time enough consider a 1 day stay in Caceres)
algrave- 2 days (3 days, where? Lagos?)
sevilla and andalucia- 3 days (3 days for Sevilla, check Granada, Cordoba, Arcos, Jerez, Cadiz, maybe somewhere on the beach)
barcelona- 2 days (3 days, check Vueling Airlines, for a flight Sevilla - Barcelona)
provence- 2 days (where? Nice, Marseille?, long trainride: check flights Barcelona - Marseille)
cinque terre- 2 days (if you want to do some hiking, extent your stay)
florence- 2 days (3-4 days, daytrips to Pisa / Siena ??)
tuscany- 2 days (where?)
rome- 3 days (4-5 days)
venice- 2 days (consider rearranging the order (CT-Venice-Florence-Rome, to end up in Rome for a flight to Vienna)
vienna- 2 days (4 days, too much to so for 2 days)
prague- 2 days (3 days, I would suggest a 1 night stop in Cesky Krumlov, on the way to Salzburg)
salzburg- 1 day (depends on trips: Lake region/Hallstätt and Werfen/Eisriesenwelt?)
tirol and bavaria- 2 days (2 days in Innsbruck??)
switzerland- 3 days (where? Interlaken / Gimmelwald ?)
munich- 2 days (2 days is good for the city, but consider daytrips to the Castles, and Dachau (unless you plan Auschwitz in the Eastern part of your trip)
romantic road- 1 day (personaly I would skip it, or just plan a visit to Nördlingen or Rothenburg ob der Tauber)
rhine river- 2 days (Cologne/Bingen/Koblenz, maybe a trip along the Mosel?)
berlin- 2 days (3-4 days, and Amsterdam is closer from here)
amsterdam- 3 days (try a flight between Amsterdam and Berlin, or plan a few days in Belgium (Brugge, and take the nighttrain, Brussels - Berlin, which also connects well to the train, from/to Amsterdam)

check www.bahn.de for the timetables for trains, and www.flightassistent.com for looking for some budget-flights.

[styrx]

Hi herrbert,
Thanks for your great help, you really gave me lots of idea and options as to how about doing the trip, really appreciate your effort and suggestions. Another big problem I have is with regards to the eurail. Which eurail selectpass you think its the best for the itinerary that you have helped us come out with?

FYI, we will be taking the selectpass for 3 countries, 8 days in 2 months. We have choosen france, italy and spain. An additional select pass for 5 countries, 10 days in 2 months. Countries choosen are germany, austria, switzerland, denmark and sweden.

P.s thanks for your great help again, I posted a similar question in the transportation thread, but was only advice to check out railsaver, which i did. And it suggested getting a global pass as well as seperate passes for eastern europe countries. But we think it will be too ex to get a global pass. Please advice. thanks!!!

[herrbert]

For transport I would suggest, you first complete your itinerary, and then check you route at www.railsaver.com

you can check www.bahn.de (go to the international guests section) for the timetables on the trainrides, but in Europe you also should consider taking flights, as they can be the best way to get around. Personaly I start to look for flights, if the trainrides get any longer than 4-5 hours. By taking some cheap flights, you can save on the number of days you need a pass, so get a cheaper one. (remember it's not just Easyjet and Ryanair that are cheap airlines, there are dozens of others)

edit: I see I mentioned bahn.de before.

[Eagle]

styrx, first, a comment on your original post. I'm VERY familiar with the Rick Steves travel books and my interpretation of the "Two Month Itinerary" in his "Back Door" book is that this is mostly intended for a somewhat "condensed" trip under ideal conditions (ie: with a Car!). The number of one and two night stops that are listed in your OP are going to get very tiring after a while!!!

herrbert has provided some great suggestions on a more "workable" Itinerary. However, there are still some "blanks" to be filled-in. As he suggests, you'll need to finalize your Itinerary to some extent before you'll be able to determine the most appropriate rail pass. In some cases, you have listed regions rather than cities, so you'll need to be more specific with those also (ie: Algarve, Tirol & Bavaria).

Good luck with your planning!!!

[madamtrashheap]

Eagle took the words right of my keyboard!

The itinerary of any organised tour is set up with transport in the form of coach/bus or car rather than trains (or flying) and as you don't have to worry about changing trains, getting to/from airports or driving on an organised tour then a 2 night stop is doable. Plus this often means leaving one city at 7am in order to reach the next destination for time to explore that afternoon, something that is restricted when you have to rely on train timetables. As an example of distance, driving from Barcelona to Provence (let's say Nice) takes a good (or that should be "bad" ) 8 hours in a car, without any interesting stops (other than roadside cafes/toilets) along the way. The train takes 12 hours. So after a full day of travel, it seems a shame to spend only 1 full day in some places.

So, for the purpose of your trip where it's written "2 days" do as Eagle and herrbert have suggested and spend 2 full days (ie 3 nights) in a place to allow for a proper amount of time to explore/experience.

[styrx]

Hi guys, finally got the tickets! Am flying to london this sun. Getting really jittery, cos its my 1st backpacking trip. Am just worried whether have I miss out any details. Anyway we will be sticking pretty close to this itinerary. Great help from herrbert n rest of the guys with all the suggestion. Here it goes:

london-4 days (flying BA to paris, eurostar is to ex)
paris-4 days (daytrip Versailles)
madrid- 4 days (daytrip to Toledo)( either fly or train, depending on cost to lisbon)
lisbon-3 days
lagos- 2 days
sevilla-3 days (daytrip to cadiz?)(fly to barca)
barcelona- 3 days
arle-2 days
nice-2 days
cinque terre- 3 days
venice- 2 days
florence- 4 days (daytrips to Pisa / Siena)
rome- 3 days (4 days) (fly to vienna)
vienna- 3 days
prague- 3 days
Cesky Krumlov- 2 days
salzburg- 2 days
switzerland- 3 days (Gimmelwald)
munich- 3 days
rhine river- 2
berlin- 3 days (fly to amsterdam)
amsterdam- 3 days (daytrip harrlem)
brussel- 2 days

I have gotten a eurail, 8 days in 2 months selectpass for italy, austria, germany, switzerland. Will be flying and buying pt to pt tickets for the rest of the trip. Can fellower expert pls comment on my itinerary, I am still open to suggestions. And for the eurail pass, which part of the itinerary should I use it, to the fullest advantages?

Thanks guys

[herrbert]

If you can find a cheap flight on Vueling, than getting to Lisbon by plane, is likely to be cheaper. (unless you use your pass).

Instead of Cadiz, you could also consider taking a daytrip to Cordoba from Sevilla. Even more radical could be to swap Sevilla for Granada. (would be a very long trip from Lagos).

For knowing where to use your pass, and where to get p2p tickets, you should get the prices of all the stretches, you are talking. In general Spain and Italy are pretty cheap countries for traveling by train.

The Rhine river area is pretty close to Amsterdam (3-4 hours by train?) and Brussels. So maye getting to Brussels (or Brugge), and Amsterdam before flying to Berlin is wiser (if possible, with the returnflight)

I would go Salzburg - Munich - Switzerland - Rhine area (getting back to Munich from Switzerland, is doing some serious backtracking.

[Eagle]

styrx, your Itinerary still looks a bit "rushed" IMO, however, if you're leaving this Sunday it doesn't leave much time for changes. One thought that occurred to me after reading over your "new" Itinerary, is that travel time between cities hasn't been mentioned except in a few cases? I suspect your actual time in each city will be less than planned, due to travel times (especially when using flights).

A few more questions and comments:

- how are you getting from Paris to Madrid? If by air, have you booked your flight yet?

- have you pre-booked any accomodations, or will you just find something when you arrive in each city?

- regarding which days to use your Rail Pass for the "fullest advantage" - if you type your Itinerary into www.railsaver.com the site will suggest which rail trips to use your pass and which trips to buy P-P tickets.

- regarding your Rail Pass - DON'T forget to get it validated before using it for the first time, or you'll get a nasy surprise!!!

If I think of any other points between now and Sunday, I'll post another note. Have a fantastic trip and don't forget to let us know how your trip is going. When you return, a Just Back report would be great! It will be interesting to hear whether everything worked out as you anticipated.

Happy travels!!!