Language Barriers?

[greeneyeddreamer]

For those who have backpacked across Europe, how did you get by not knowing the language? Especially in places like train stations?

Did you learn some conversational phrases beforehand?

[WillTravel]

Yes, it's a good idea to learn some conversational phrases. To be honest, these sometimes desert me when I most want to use them. I've never had any problem communicating, one way or another.

If you are at a train station, you can prepare ahead of time by writing down what you want, like this:

Roma -> Venezia, 18:00 31/05/2008

Note the local language placenames, the military time, and the European date format.

This is just for emergency use - most likely, you will be able to get what you want without it.

I do like to carry a dictionary around to help me read various things. If you do a bit of study, you'll know how the verbs are conjugated, which will really help.

[me]

greeneyeddreamer said:

For those who have backpacked across Europe, how did you get by not knowing the language? Especially in places like train stations?

you obviously speak English, Rena. English works most places, as it's the international language.

in train stations, the signs often use symbols which are common across Europe. the only potential problem is if there's a train's running late or gets changed to a different track. the announcement might be in the local language only, but it'd likely be followed with an English translation.

it helps just to pay attention to what's going on around you: if you're on a platform waiting for a train with a crowd of people, there's a bong noise, followed by by several sentences from the loudspeaker in a language you don't know, after which the crowd starts walking en mass to a different platform, you may wish to tag along.

[greeneyeddreamer]

willtravel said:

Note the local language placenames, the military time, and the European date format.

I grew up in Israel where military time is commonly used instead of AM/PM and I always always the European date format just because it what I was taught as a kid! So no problem in that department.

[pointofnoreturn]

I honestly think that you have nothing to worry about. I didn't experience any problems in terms of the language "barrier". It should be fine.

[herrbert]

A lot of times it can also be funny ... and with pointing you can get what you want in a shop. I would always learn a little bit about the languages, because people always like it if you at least try to speak there language. (and when they find out that you speak english, they often like to practise there English)

In some countries in Europe it is really easy to speak English as most people speak it as a second language, and use it at work. (the Netherlands, Scandinavian Countries, Portugal).

For trainstations/busstations I would prepare, and know the local names for places. It can also help to know a little bit about the timetable. In places like Spain you pay different amounts for different trains. In general: the faster the train, you more you pay. So sometimes it can save you money to take a train later or earlier.

[me]

greeneyeddreamer said:

I grew up in Israel where military time is commonly used instead of AM/PM and I always always the European date format just because it what I was taught as a kid! So no problem in that department.

it seems that the European date format is backward. but, the 24 hour clock does makes more sense in today's world - where things happen round the clock. [the expression "round the clock" is a holdover from what caused am/pm to begin with. a Medieval clock just couldn't strike 24. it was too much for it's primitive workings]

[Eagle]

greeneyeddreamer, my experiences have been somewhat similar to those of the others. In many locations in Europe you'll find that English is somewhat the "universal language" and you won't have any problems. However, it's still a good idea to learn some common phrases (please, thankyou, etc.) in the local language and I usually pack a Phrasebook along for the countries I'll be visiting. As herrbert mentioned, sometimes the "locals" will want to practise their English, and in those cases it's a good idea to speak slowly and enunciate words carefully (without using "slang"). You'll probably find (as I did) that the residents of some countries are far more proficient in English than others.

There will be times though when you'll need help. For example, as David mentioned it's a bit problematic to understand messages on PA systems in the rail stations. First of all, the sound is often slightly distorted which makes the words hard to understand and also they sometimes speak quickly. I used the same method as David in determining which train to board, especially in Italy - if the "gong" sounded along with a PA message, and the crowd started to move towards a particular train, that was usually the correct one (if that was about the time my train was leaving).

In the case of trains, you can also ask either train officials at the station or other travellers. In the station at Frankfurt airport on my last trip, I was speaking with a couple of German girls that had just returned from Malaysia, and they kept me up to speed on the PA messages (I had been told that German trains were never late, however on that occasion the train was over an hour late!). I encountered a somewhat "odd" situation on board the train though, as I couldn't understand the PA messages. I happened to be sitting in a compartment with some Chinese students that were in Germany to study the language. They could speak Chinese, fairly good German and some English. They kindly translated the messages for me.

With regard to Italy, I've spoken with many people that told me "don't worry about the language, lots of Italians, especially the younger ones, can all speak English. I found that was NOT true, as I spoke with several "younger" Italians that couldn't speak a word of English. I was thankful that I'm able to function in Italian to some extent, as it helped throughout my trip.

I had a few problems in France though. I guess I need a refresher course as my "high school French" doesn't seem to be up to par. In one case that comes to mind, I was trying to buy a rail ticket for Bayeux, but the ticket agent couldn't understand what I was saying (or pretended not to understand?). I didn't feel that my pronunciation was that bad. When I wrote the word on a piece of paper, her comprehension improved! Other than that, I just had a few minor difficulties.

As the others have mentioned, you'll have to get used to the 24-hour clock and the way that Europeans write the date (D/M/Y). I always have to adapt to that when I travel, as I'm used to the Y/M/D format at work and at home. Also, when looking at prices you'll notice that a comma is used rather than a decimal point as the separator between "dollars and cents". As herrbert mentioned, you'll have to know the local name for various cities (ie: Florence will be shown as Firenze, Venice will be Venezia, etc.). Note also that there can be several rail stations in each city, so you'll have to be clear on which one you're travelling to or from!

Hopefully you'll have a chance to read Europe Through The Back Door, as that's all explained in the book.

Cheers!

[greeneyeddreamer]

eagle said:

As the others have mentioned, you'll have to get used to the 24-hour clock and the way that Europeans write the date (D/M/Y). I always have to adapt to that when I travel, as I'm used to the Y/M/D format at work and at home.

This is a bit off topic but Ive never seen the Y/M/D system used. In Canada, the most common format is M/D/Y which totally confuses me since I am so used to the way I was taught as a child, D/M/Y, so I wont have a problem with that!

[Eagle]

greeneyeddreamer, Regarding the date format, it's possible the Y/M/D format is used mostly by government agencies in Canada, and that's why you haven't seen too much of that format (I'm also in Canada). Have a look at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_8601 for a more detailed explanation. Although some stores and others use the M/D/Y format, I've been using Y/M/D for as long as I can remember, as well as the 24-hour (military / aviation) time system.

[me]

eagle said:

[Although some stores and others use the M/D/Y format, I've been using Y/M/D for as long as I can remember, as well as the 24-hour (military / aviation) time system.

in America, MM/DD/YYYY is the standard date format. (pre-Y2K it was MM/DD/YY) but, YYYY/MM/DD would make more sense. after all, date is just time on a larger scale. we express time HH:MM.SS, longest increment to shortest. shouldn't we be consistent? [although Ralph "where's Waldo" Emerson once wrote "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds," i don't think consistency is particularly foolish]

- d

[francefiend]

The French love their language more than they love themselves. It definitely pays off to know a little bit before you go. Most signs are in at least 3 languages, but you never know when you might have to speak to a French person.

If you can only learn three words in French, let it be these. The French are huge on etiquette. If you are not polite, they may treat you like crap without warning or explanation... They can speak English quite well, but they're shy Don't fret; just know these three words/phrases:

1. Bonjour - ALWAYS ALWAYS greet a person in a store with a Bonjour during the day or a Bonsoir (bon swar) in the evening. Do not walk into a place without acknowledging a shopkeeper/owner. The person will be 500x times nicer to you and helpful after you say this ONE word. Add "Madame" for a woman and "Monsieur" for a man.

2. S'il vous plaît = seal voo play - Your mother told you to say please. Don't stop saying it when you get to France. Add it onto any request.

3. Merci = mare see, not like the English word "mercy." - Even if the person hasn't helped you at all, say thank you. It can't hurt.

4. (Extra Credit) - Excusez-moi de vous déranger = excuse-ay mwah de voo day ro(n) jay Make the last jay very smooth - not hard. It means "sorry for bothering you." It's a great introduction to ask a French person for help (After saying Bonjour, of course!)

Other helpful bits:

1. Gare SNCF = train station. Usually within walking distance of the town.

2. Gare TGV = train station for high speed trains (= train à grande vitesse). Some regular train stations handle TGV trains, while others do not. Some towns have two train stations, one for local trains and one for high speed trains (ex. Aix and Avignon). It's important to know which one you need. Often, the TGV stations are outside the town itself, but there are shuttles (= navettes) that take you into town (= centre-ville). In Paris, all six main train stations handle high speed trains.

3. Gare routière = bus station

4. Office du Tourisme = Guess what this means. They can give you FREE maps, advice, information on the surrounding area...whatever. Look for a sign with an italicized "i" on it.

5. Billets = tickets. Billets d'avion = plane tickets. Aller-Retour = round trip. Aller-Simple = one way. Grandes lignes = major rail lines, meaning if you are a train station/metro station combo, follow signs that say Grandes Lignes to reach intercity/high speed trains.

6. Periode de pointe = rush hour = tickets will be more expensive and trains will sell out quicker.

7. Car = short for autocar, meaning coach bus. It can be a tour bus or a shuttle. Our cars are voitures.

8. Nonfumeur = supposedly nonsmoking. Varies from place to place.

9. Carafe d'eau = small pitcher of tap water. Important, because it's FREE. cah-rahf dough. Eau gazeuse = carbonated/seltzer water. Eau plate = regular water.

10. Un Coca, s'il vous plaît = when you just can't think of anything else to order.

[greeneyeddreamer]

Im Canadian so I know all the basic conversational french, but I was told that Canadian French is so different from real french.
The friend I plan on going with is fluent! wooohoo!

[crystal]

I have a little phrasebook by lonely planet that includes about 10 different languages. Mine is an Eastern European one but I'm sure they do a western european one as well. It means you have one quite small phrasebook that should help you even if you are moving from country to country. It is not in depth language study and doesn't really help when 'hearing' a language but it really helps me read signs, timetables, menus, greetings and ask for basic things. It also has a handy 'emergency' phrases section - I've been robbed, I feel ill ect.

[francefiend]

greeneyeddreamer said:

Im Canadian so I know all the basic conversational french, but I was told that Canadian French is so different from real french.
The friend I plan on going with is fluent! wooohoo!

Lucky you

Some French people allegedly don't understand Canadian French, but I think you'll be fine.