Help w/ My First Euro Adventure

[alligatormtn]

I will be studying abroad in Florence (FUA) beginning Sept 3rd. My girlfriend will be over at the cooking school, Apicius (sp?). We are leaving around August 12th or so and plan on flying into London and making our way down. We've looked into RyanAir and EasyJet as possible lowcost airlines that can get us numerous places relatively cheap - however we feel like we're missing out on the experience if we fly everywhere. Here is what our goal is...start in 'northern' europe and make our way to Florence by Sept. 2nd. We are flying from Atlanta, GA so flights to Paris and London are relatively cheap - and we get a discount through the study abroad program.

We are thinking this..
London (2-3 nights)
Brussels and Brugges (we want to find a good hotel and spend one night in Brugge to relax and take it all in)
Amsterdam>
Dusseldorf>
Fraknfurt
Paris (day trip to Versailles - time tbd, I want to see the Louvre as well as the city)
Grenoble/Nimes
Zurich
Florence

I have only traveled to Europe before, my girlfriend has never been. I will be celebrating my 21st Bday while there and my parents are coming over during my break and we're going to head to Santorini and Athens Greece. We are open to all suggestions. We want to do touristy things, but want to go to off the beaten path places. We are huge foodies (my parents own a restaurant, and are opening a new truly tuscan italian restaurant that i'll be running when I graduate) so we want to explore the cuisine.

Our main concerns are...
How to get from place to place?
Rail pass vs flying
hostels vs hotels
how to save $$ without sacrificing our trip.

Cheers,
JB

[herrbert]

Hi JB,

OK, where to start ??

Don't only look into RyanAir and Easyjet for cheapflights, there are about 50 to 60 cheap airlines in Europe. With RyanAir always take a good look at where they are flying you. They can be cheap, but they also use distant airports. (e.g. when they tell you Paris, Düsseldorf or Barcelona, you need look into it, and find out that they will fly you to Beauvais, Weeze and Girona instead!!, and by all means those are not the only examples)

If you are looking at Brugge and Amsterdam, then reverse them and see if you can get a cheap flight from London to Amsterdam (check a small airline called VLM Airlines. If you book far enough ahead, you should get some good bargains. another plus is that they fly from London City Airport, which you can reach by Metro/Underground/Tube, or whatever you want to call it, and is not as huge as Heathrow).

I would choose for Brugge, and if you want to explore some of the other towns in Belgium, take a look at Antwerpen, Gent and Leuven. All of these towns (and also Brussel) are not that far away, and doable by train.

Düsseldorf and Frankfurt are places I would skip, although I go to Düsseldorf every once in a while, I can't really recommend it as a travel destination. The same is true for Frankfurt, I don't think there is a lot to see in both of these places. (I also have my doubts about Grenoble/Nimes and Zürich btw, but can't comment on them) If you want to spend some time in Germany I would rather opt for Berlin, I admit it is on the beaten track, but that has it's reasons. Another interesting place in Germany can be Dresden.

If you want to go to Santorini and Athens, then check on the EasyJet flight leaving from Milan (maybe you can book a returnflight, as you need to end up in Florence). At least take enough time in Greece. Athens can be done in 3 days, but getting to Santorini can take some time, so calculate another 3-4 days.

I don't know what you mean with seeing the Louvre, but seeing everything inside, will take a very long time. I think you'd better focus on one wing.

If you are an art lover, I would suggest adding Madrid to the shortlist. The Prado has a very nice collection of art, the Reina Sofia a good collection of Modern Art (including Guernika by Picasso), and the Thyssen is a pretty good museum, with a lot fo everything. Daytrips to Toledo and Segovia are in my opinion a must.

For art I also love Vienna. A couple years ago the Museumquartier (or MQ) opened, which has a couple of very good modern art museums (including MuMok), but in Vienna you can also find the huge 'Kunsthistorisches Museum' (opposite the hofburg).

Both cities might not be on route, but with a flight, it might be possible to add them.

A bit more on route, might be the 5 towns that make up Cinque Terre. But maybe you can also see them as a weekend trip from Florence, in the time you study there.

[alligatormtn]

Thank you for the reply and tips!

I've been looking into reasonable routes, trying to make a circle and make my way to florence.

Frankfurt and Dusseldorf - I have no reason for going their except for knowing the names of the towns. I've never been interested in Germany or its cuisine, but i've been told its somewhere thats most definitely worth a visit. I figured we'd stay there no more than one night.

I am most excited about Belgium so i'm very open to visiting more places. I said Frankfurt because Frankfurt>Paris seems like a train ride or easy flight. Berlin looked cool, but at the same time i just don't know much about it.

Also, for the Louvre - I meant focusing on one wing, so give myself a day or so.

[alligatormtn]

Ok after doing a little more research here's what I think I like the best....

Paris (day trip to versaille)
Brugge (one night)
Brussels
Antwerp (one night)
Amsterdam
Prague (possibly skip and go straight to Fussen)
Fussen Germany (Go see the castles)
Innsbruck

I'd like to be able to visit Prague, but it might not be possible to do in this time. This gives us 2 extra days so we have room to be flexible while we're traveling. So now my question is...is this a good plan to take all by train? Nothing is too far in distance...since we have extra days maybe we can add a small town in between one place to the next to rest and such.

Global EuroRail Pass??

[madamtrashheap]

alligatormtn, can I suggest spending only one night in Brussels and two in Brugge/Bruges instead. That way you could also visit Antwerp for a day (if that's still on the cards) whilst still soaking in the fabulousness that is Brugge. Or, visit Antwerp for half a day on the way to Amsterdam.

I'd also suggest staying in Munich for 2 days (3 nights) rather than Fuessen, which will allow a day trip to Fussen to see all the castles, time in Munich, even a chance to go out to Dachau for half a day and access to the airport which will have a greater range of flight destinations than Innsbruck airport (at the moment, only a few airlines fly in there whereas Munich offers a little more choice. Innsbruck is only 2 hours by train from Munich so it's close. It would be great if you could slot Berlin in there, but alas...next time!

If you can throw Prague in, even for 1-2 days, you won't be disappointed. But if not, there's always the next trip! Or you could even do a weekend trip from Florence (Meridiana fly direct from Florence, or from Pisa take Sky Europe) when you're based there.

You may have to adjust your itinerary direction/order a little, but this will help determine the routes on which you fly and those on which you take the train.

Can I ask what time of year you are going to Greece? That is, when during your time in Europe (before or after you start school)?

[alligatormtn]

Thanks for the tips. I'll look into staying in Munich and making day trips. I'm assuming taking a shuttle type train to Fussen won't be an issue.

I'll look into Brugge for another night - Antwerp is still in the picture and seems like a good idea for a half day and then head to Amsterdam that evening.

Prague will most likely be skipped mainly because getting there from Florence later on will be no issue at all, and i'll have a friend living there starting in September so i'll be visiting there for sure.

How about after leaving Amsterdam head to Munich? From there we can stay a few nights and take day trips to the castles. From Munich we can head to Innsbruck and if we have extra time to spend we can make our way into Italy, or even head over to Southern france.

We are trying to get a Select Youth Pass for 5 Countries. We'd like to keep flying to a minimum, but if we must we will fly.

I think we'll skip Berlin and maybe spend a weekend there while we're staying in Florence.

Greece - We'll be visiting in October - it seems as though it's the only time we can go and spend a good amount of time there. I know its not ideal but I don't want to leave Europe without seeing Greece.

My idea was to maybe make an itinerary that will make train rides as short as can be ...starting in France and looping our way into Italy.

[madamtrashheap]

alligatormtn said:

Greece - We'll be visiting in October - it seems as though it's the only time we can go and spend a good amount of time there. I know its not ideal but I don't want to leave Europe without seeing Greece.

You're right, it's not ideal in terms of the time of year (hence my question) as a lot of accommodation and restaurants close down at the start of October, so check we ahead in your plans as this may alter where you go. It gets very windy (I mean VERY) in the Aegean in Autumn/Fall so ferries can sometimes be cancelled or postponed - just something to keep in mind for your planning.

[alligatormtn]

I've been doing some looking into Hostels (still not sure whats the best place to find the best deal) and this is going to change some things for me...

Germany - I don't have too much interest here except to see the castles and the Black Forest. Munich looks interesting, and i'm sure its beautiful. Hussen is closer to the castles and the hostels are $30+/- cheaper then in Munich. I figured maybe stay in Munich one night then head to Hussen, or a smaller town near the castles and stay there.

My biggest issue now is finding a place in Paris that we can afford for 4 nights. We're going to get a decent hotel room in Brugge, and our last night (money pending) we want to stay in a good hotel in Innsbruck. So far things are looking like they'll be at least $35 a night per person...things can get pretty expensive - maybe we should look into overnight trains when possible.

Paris(4nights w/ day trip to versaille)>
Champagne(we want to tour a champagne vineyard, its the one thing my girlfriend really wants to do)>
Lille(maybe just a stop for the afternoon)>
Brugge(2nights)>
Brussels(1 night)>
Amsterdam(possible day stop in Antwerp..3 nights)>
Munich (night train?? 1 night)>
Fussen or surrounding area (2 nights)>
Vienna(1-2 nights)>
Innsbruch (2-3 nights)

Obviously with the $$ as horrible as it is we're going to have to plan this out pretty well because $$ will not be unlimited. While in Paris, we want to stay in Paris not on the outskirts...Whereas with Munich, the idea was to see it, but mainly focus on day trips to the castles and such...

Anyone have any tips for Hostels/Hotels - we don't really have any requirements except its 1)Safe 2)Reasonably Comfortable 3)Reasonably Priced

[Eagle]

alligatormtn, for Hostels in Munich, you might have a look at either Wombat's or www.hihostels.com.

HI has some 2-bed rooms listed, but I suspect those might book up quickly. I believe the price starts at about Eu$20.50 per night. The Munich property seems to be slightly out of the city centre, but easily accessible to the Metro. Wombat's is closer, but I don't have much information on it, as I've never stayed there (I used a Hotel in Munich on my last visit, and will be using the same Hotel again next month).

Good luck!

[WillTravel]

I think this is one of the cheapest places you can stay in Paris, and the location is pretty good. If I understand correctly, a private double room will be 40 Euros, but you'll have to double-check.
www.aijparis.com/framea.htm

[madamtrashheap]

alligatormtn said:

Germany - I don't have too much interest here except to see the castles and the Black Forest. Munich looks interesting, and i'm sure its beautiful. Hussen is closer to the castles and the hostels are $30+/- cheaper then in Munich. I figured maybe stay in Munich one night then head to Hussen, or a smaller town near the castles and stay there.

The Hussen I know of is up in the Rheinland region (east of Bonn), whilst Füssen (Fuessen) is the town south of Munich and on the Romantic Road that goes past Neuschwanstein, Hohenschwangau and Linderhof castles (Ludwig II). There are castles along the Rhein, some of which you can stay in, so did you intend to visit both regions or just one? The Black Forest is to the south west of the country, but still a while from Munich (it's closer to Heidelberg in this case). And yes, Munich is pretty and worth at least one day.

[alligatormtn]

I said Hussen and I meant Fussen

sorry for the confusion

[herrbert]

It is possible to go by buss from Füssen to Innsbruck, it likely involves a stopover in Reutte (which is just across the border in Austria).

Therefor I think Füssen - Innbruck - Vienna is the better way to go.

In the more rural parts of Southern Germany and Austria, you can often find a private room for a very reasonable price. You just have to be on the look out for the signs saying 'zimmer frei' (room vacant). If you like to go of the beaten track, then this is a pretty good area to go without a reservation, and to stay in one of the small towns, or maybe on a farm. The tourist information office (Fremden-verkehrs-verband), in these places are likely to have options for you.

[alligatormtn]

Thanks for the tips.

We've been discussing the idea of taking a train to Budapest. We wouldn't be able to use the select saver youth 5 country eurorail pass, so we'd have to buy a city to city ticket. i've been looking at railsaver.com and it seems like a reasonable price to get to budapest from autria. If we do budapest we'd go from Germany to Vienna, then to Budapest - overnight train to Florence, IT.

We've got a little while to decide but i've heard Budapest is a must see. It also seems to be a good bit cheaper. Casino's also look like fun!

[herrbert]

I don't know the prices of your passes or train tickets, but maybe take a look at a flight from Budapest to Florence. Meridiana should service that flight on Thursdays and Sundays. (I get a price of 77.40, incl taxes, for a flight in July - ignore their call for choosing an returnflight)

www.meridiana.it/IG/pages/home_en.aspx#