Mediterranean Backpacking

[jriley04]

Hi everyone!! We are in the very beginning stages (like we decided to do this yesterday) of planning a backpacking trip for May 2009 it will last for sure 4 weeks..(who knows we might quit our jobs and stay longer )

First we have for sure have 4 people, and possibly a 5th person that will be coming. Has anyone ever traveled with a group this large? Is it going to be difficult to get rooms in Hostels? We have known each other for years and have a lot of similiar interests and for the ones not wanted to go see historical stuff are very happy to be dropped off at a bar and picked up later. It is a mixed group though, 3 guys 2 girls and we would want to stay together..are most hostels co-ed?

This is our tentative plan for now.
Fly from NYC to Barcelona
Spain (Barcelona)
France (Marseille & Monaco)
Italy (Rome for sure..Naples is it worth it? any other stops along the way)
Greece (Athens...need to know the best way to get to Turkey)
Turkey (Istanbul..any other must see place thats on the way)
Amsterdam (No clue how to get there..but this place can not be missed...the guys would kill us so any suggestions)

I'm assuming trains would be taken the majority of the way. I'm going to have reread the section on rail passes, my first glance through and I was lost.

I'm figuring about 5k for the whole trip including my plane ticket there and back. If I can do this cheaper, then i absolutely will...if it looks to be an expensive trip i can go up to 7k, but we want the backpacking experience not the resort experience, so I'm hoping to lower this budget significantly...the only expensive thing i could see would be drinks..we are drinkers.

So any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[Eagle]

jriley04, it's great that you're getting an early start on your planning! That allows lots of time to work out the "fine details".

First of all, your question concerning the number in your party. I typically travel "solo" these days, so haven't had the experience of travelling with a group that size. However, one of my relatives took a four month (or so) backpacking trip to Europe a few years ago with several friends, and I believe the trip went reasonably well (although I think there were a few disagreements). I suspect the "key" is to allow each member of the group some free time to see whichever sights interest them the most. Allowing some "space" for everyone, rather than being together all the time, is probably a good idea.

A few thoughts on the places you listed, and some that you didn't:

> NYC to Barcelona sounds good - how many days in Barcelona (herrbert will be able to provide some definite advice on that)?

> France - Marseille & Monaco - my preference would be to drop Marseille and choose another more interesting city, perhaps Arles, Avignon or Aix-en-Provence.

> Italy - Rome for sure! Plan to spend at least 4-5 days there. Plan your touring carefully so that you don't waste any time! I'd suggest choosing a few other locations in Italy, as it's an incredible country, one that you won't forget! Would the group be interested in the Cinque Terre, Florence, Venice, Siena or other locations in Tuscany or Umbria, Sorrento, Positano or other locations on the Amalfi Coast - there are LOTS of choices. You could certainly visit Naples, but that would depend on what you're interested in seeing there? I was there in May and it has a noticeably different "culture" than Italy north of Rome. The Archeological Museum might not hold much interest for your group, but it's an easy ride from Naples to Pompeii and Herculaneum on the Circumvesuviana train.

> Greece - most here seem to feel that two days is an adequate time frame to see Athens. If you're not planning to visit any of the islands (Santorini, Mykonos, Crete, etc.), you might want to leave Greece for a future visit, considering the time and expense to get there for such a short visit.

> Turkey - again, this a bit "out of the way". If you're very committed to going there, you might want to consider budget airlines. I haven't checked so don't know which Euro airlines fly that route?

> Amsterdam - this is not a hard city to get to. You might consider using "open jaw" flights, and book your flight home from Amsterdam. Schiiphol Airport is a major hub, so finding flights to NYC shouldn't be a problem.

Is your group interested in any other cities in Europe? There's sure a lot to choose from! Some of the other places that you didn't mention: Croatia (various cities), Germany, Austria, Prague, Budapest, cities in northern France (you didn't list Paris?), and lots of choices in England and Ireland and of course Switzerland (Gimmelwald is a big favourite here).

Some Hostels are co-ed and some are single gender. You'll have to look at individual Hostels to determine which ones are co-ed. Once you have a more definite list of cities, it will be a lot easier to recommend specific Hostels.

Regarding the travel budget that you mentioned, will every member of your group be working with about the same amount? For a four-week (or longer) trip, I suspect that US$7000 is going to be about the minimum. I'm not sure what the airfares from NYC to Europe are priced at right now, but it's certainly possible these will be a bit higher next year due to the "fuel situation". I suspect you might need at least US$1000 each for the return tickets (you might want to speak with a travel agent about open jaw flights).

The next expense item to consider will be the cost of rail and / or budget airline tickets in Europe. It's difficult to work out rail pass details until you have a definite list of cities, and the order you'll be visiting them. A Rail Pass may or may not be the best option.

The last budget item to consider is daily expenses, which will include Hostel charges, food, incidentals and of course drinks (you mentioned that you're "drinkers"). If you buy drinks in Clubs or whatever, these tend to add up fairly quickly. Some of our younger European members will be able to provide more specifics on that. Realistically, you should probably budget at least €85 per day (about US$131 per day).

Even for those that want the "backpacking experience not the resort experience", Europe is expensive especially with the exchange rates these days! I calculated the amount of €85 per day by using the following amounts:

- €30 for Hostel (may be a bit more or bit less, depending on which Hostels you use)

- €30 for food (you'll usually only pay for lunches and dinners, as most places provide a "Continental breakfast" in the cost of the room - if you use restaurants the cost could be higher)

- €25 for daily incidentals (I don't think that amount is unreasonable, as you'll need to pay for local transport, admission to various attractions such as the Colosseum in Rome which is about €11 per person now and of course drinks and souvenirs). If you're travelling with a Rail Pass, you'll also have to pay the reservation fees on specific trains, which can be about €18 each! - if you use budget airlines, typically these use out-of-the-way airports, so you'll have to allow the time and expense of getting into the city centres - if you decide to leave Greece on the list, you'll have to pay for either air tickets or the Ferry from Brindisi to Athens and then back out of your "incidentals".

Unless you can increase your travel budget, quitting your jobs and staying longer might be a bit difficult. Hopefully the others will have some thoughts on this as well.

I should mention that I'm not trying to be "negative" about your travel plans, but simply trying to give you a realistic idea of some of the issues you'll be facing. The most cost effective way to travel Europe is to choose cities that are relatively close geographically, and use train to travel between them. If the rail journeys involve long distances or fast trains (such as the TGV in France) the cost increases and this is where a rail pass is a good option.

If this is your first trip to Europe, I'd highly recommend that everyone in your group read the Guidebook Europe Through The Back Door, as it will provide a lot of good information on trip planning, money and especially rail skills. It's an essential pre-read!

Happy planning!

[WillTravel]

I agree with Eagle's cost breakdown. And there always seems to be something that requires a one-time cost - like maybe bandages, or an extra train segment, a concert, or a sudden increase in price. If you budget more than you end up using - all the better, as you'll come back with money.

If you really want to spend X days in Europe, and you are committed to a low budget, here are some tips:
Look for a location that is cheap. Berlin is one example. There are many places in central and eastern Europe, and southern Europe, that are relatively cheaper. Some examples of expensive cities: London, Paris, Venice, Rome, Florence. They are fabulous, and there are definitely ways to save, but they are not cheap.

Arrange to spend a good number of days in each location. The more days you spend in one spot, the cheaper it gets, as you save on food (buying milk and a loaf of bread and cheese and so forth is economical, as you can use it all up), transportation (local transit passes become a good deal), and activities (with more time in a city, you tend to relax a bit more and enjoy free things). Some hostels give deals like X days for the price of X-1.

Work out the cheapest transportation methods in advance. With Deutsche Bahn - www.bahn.de - you can often buy 29-Euro train tickets for destinations that are far apart, if you do so 3 months in advance (sometimes less). With sncf.com (the French site), you can get cheap PREMS tickets for 20 Euros for trips that would typically cost several times the price. www.whichbudget.com lists cheap flights - but these must typically be booked months in advance too.