Italy 2009

[jennifer]

Hi there
Well, since my last trip to spain I've kind of neglected gfe but i'm back. I have a long trip to plan ahead and want your great advice.

I'll be going to Italy for 3-4 weeks and bringing my mom along so she can see the world a little and see what my passion is all about. I won't have to answer the "but why so long and what do you do out there, don't you get bored"

I can't wait to show her around.
After she leaves, i'm going to stick around Italy for another 2 weeks, then hop over in Germany to visit people and friends and Freiburg where I stayed in 2006

Then a week in France to visit friends

So basically 2 months ahead of me. This comes just before a huge career change, before starting my life as a full time independant worker. I can't wait for that moment, I can't take the corporate life anymore



So here's where you guys come in:

I have the guidebook and have read posts about italy, I know the ropes, but I want your advice on exceptional stuff, not to miss. Stuff that isn't necessarily in the guidebooks, things that I'll remember forever

I'm not a huge museum type

I would love to take a cooking class, something with wine too maybe,

are there special hostels that are worth the detour, like in villas, castles, etcs, i dunno


Thanks guys, i know this is a long one!

[Eagle]

Jennifer, welcome back! Wow, that's an ambitious trip you're planning! I don't have any concrete suggestions at the moment, but a few thoughts.....

Although you're not a "huge museum type", your Mom may be interested in seeing a few of the famous Museums and other historic sites so a compromise may be necessary. If you keep the visits short, it might be more tolerable for you. What about art galleries? I was going to suggest the Borghese Gallery in Rome. Of course, the Uffizi and Accademia in Florence would be good stops also. Where in Italy do you want to travel?

Has your Mom read the Guidebook also? If this is her first trip to Europe, she might want to have a look at Europe Through the Back Door, so that she has a good idea what to expect in terms of culture, language, train travel and also the types of food to expect in Italy (breakfasts are certainly not the same as in Germany or Austria). Which Guidebook are you using?

Has your Mom expressed any interest in seeing particular sites, perhaps after watching travel shows on TV? I'll do some checking on the cooking classes and post another note if I find anything.

Will your Mom be comfortable in a Hostel? You might want to consider budget Hotels also.

I can most definitely empathize with your sentiments regarding the "corporate life". I'm about 10 months from being retired, and will be glad to leave that behind (however, I will miss my co-workers).

If I think of any other suggestions, I'll post another note.

Good luck with your planning!

[madamtrashheap]

Ciao jennifer! Glad to see you back around these parts, and to hear that you're going to take your Mom to Italy next - great choice!

So much to choose from in Italy - where to start?!! (which is probably what you're asking too ;D). I'm a big fan of Sicily, Amalfi Coast and Tuscany, and of course there are other things in each place to check out, so I'll try to list a few things across the country that might interest you. btw, what time of year are you looking at travelling? There are all sorts of festivals, etc throughout the year that might suit you.

Florence
For me, Florence is all about the food (wait, make that Italy!), so some of the greatest things you can do are to sample all sorts of delights around the city and the region. Cooking classes are popular here, but I'm afraid I haven't been to any as I have friends who have shown me the ropes (yep, I'm spoilt). I have, however, heard good things about Apicus, which is the Culinary Institute in Florence. There's also the ABC School, which is a language school (that I studied at years ago) that now offers other courses including cookery, wine and art courses There is a Truffle Festival in a town called San Miniato (between Florence and Pisa, not the church above Florence) in November that is just amazing if you're there at that time of year.

For restaurants, trattorie and markets - try foods like Bistecca Fiorentina /i] (Florentine Steak - t-bone from the Chianina cows of Tuscany), Fagiole (warm with olive oil, parsley and garlic is a great side dish), Ribollita (a great Winter soup), Crostini Toscani (mixed Tuscan crostini/bruschette), Fettunta (Tuscan version of garlic bread - excellent!), Ravioli Nudi (naked ravioli), anything with Funghi Procini (Porcini Mushrooms) especially if it's the season (Autumn), anything with Tartufi (truffles!), Panzanella (bread salad), Pecorino Toscano (Tuscan Pecorino cheese, variety of ages), Lampredotto (if you're feeling adventurous - it's an "offal" sandwich, popular in the Merato Centrale and very Florentine), Vin Santo con Cantucci (Vin Santo or sweet holy wine with biscotti from Prato), Chianti Classico (the real Chianti!), Vernaccia (white wine from San Gimignano), Pomino (white or red style, Frescobaldi brand is good), Bunello di Montalcino (amazing red wine from Montalcino). A great traditional Trattoria is "Dei Fagiole” in Corso dei Tintori, just off Via de’Benci and between the river and Santa Croce. It looks old, and it is, but it has the best local and traditional produce and dishes around. Open Bar, on the Boboli side of the Ponte Vecchio, is a great place for an aperitivo before dinner - try to sit by the window for views along the River Arno.

Quirky things: Medici Chapel - you're not into museums, but if you do want to see some Michelangelo sculptures that aren't as well known, then visit this chapel in the morning. Same goes for Orsanmichele, a little chapel on the via Calzaiuoli (shopping street) that is worth a 5 min detour. Mercato Centrale - the main food market in Florence, just near the San Lorenzo flea market, is great for getting into the food and wine of the region. Walk up the pathway under the trees to the Piazzalle Michelangelo for great views over the city, then have a coffee at the cafe on the terrace below the lookout. Or keep walking further up to the church of San Minato that looks over the Piazalle. Segway Tour - they are now in Florence and provide an interesting skill navigating the cobblestones! For accommodation with a rural slant, the Agriturismo ventures in Italy have really taken off so you can stay on a working farm or in accommodation (some luxurious, some basic) that is part of a large estate. I've visited Castello Il Palagio ( www.castelloilpalagio.it ), which is 25km south of Florence, between Florence and San Gimignano, and surrounded by vineyards (yum!), and they do wine and olive oil tastings, but it can be tricky to get to without private transport.

Having said all of that, a visit to either the Uffizi or Accademia (or both) is worth it, but again, if you're not into museums/art, etc then the joy of just wandering the city will do you just fine. Other places to visit around the region are San Gimignano (day trip), Siena (day or overnight - check the star ceiling of the Duomo), Montepulciano, Montalcino and Pisa for a few hours and a cheesey photo!

Rome
Living history, so apart from the big sights, there are lots of little nooks and crannies in Rome to explore. The Keyhole of Rome is somethign a little different if you're wandering over in that general vicinity (Circus Maximus) - Located on Piazza dei Cavalieri di Malta on the Aventine Hill; Walk along via del Teatro Marcello & via Petroselli leading to the church of Santa Maria in Cosmedin (where the Bocca della Verità - Mounth of Truth - is). Turn around the church on the left on via della Greca and walk uphill on Clivio dei Publici & via di Santa Sabina that ends on the Piazza dei Cavalieri di Malta. Just down the street (about 20m from the end, on right) from the Orange Garden, is a small "key hole" in a large green door that offers a memorable view of the dome of St. Peter's. If you're on the Metro, then take Linea B: stop Circo Massimo, then walk north along the Circus Maximus and turn left up the hill (Via Valle Murcia to Via di Santa Sabina). Pantheon - one of my two favorite buildings in Rome (the other is the Colosseum), it's a good quick visit to take and marvel at ancient architecture. Capuchin Crypt at Santa Maria della Concezione church (Crypt open: 9-12noon and 3-6pm); located in via Veneto just off Piazza Baberini (Metro stop of the same same); leave a Euro1 or 2 donation at the door and pay your respects to the bones of over 4000 capuchin monks that have been used to "decorate" the crypt - look for the spooky sign at the end. Gelati (it's always plural!) at the Ai Tre Tartufi shop on Piazza Navona or at the gourmet San Crispino ( www.ilgelatodisancrispino.it/ ) on via della Panetteria near the Trevi Fountain. Climb the cupola of St Peter's and look down into the Pope's vegetable garden! Great pizza shop on a side street between the columns of St Peter's and the entrance to the Vatican Museums (either via delle Grazie or Borgo Vittorio, can never remember, but the pizza place is on the right of the street). Coffee or an aperitivo in Canova on Piazza del Popolo and pay homage to Fellini. Wander the streets behind Piazza Navona for small tratorrie and family-run restaurants with great food (Pasta Cabonara originated in Rome).

In the region: Civita di Bagnoreggio - Eagle's favourite so I'll let him give the recommendations (he's been there more recently than me too).

Amalfi Coast
Sorrento - my favourite town in this part of the world, even though many others prefer Positano. Great bar called Bar Fauno where you can sit and watch the world go by of a late afternoon, wander the old town and either eat in a trattoria or buy your produce from the excellent shops and then sit on your hotel balcony with a feast, not cooking once! Capri - take the boat (fast or slow) to the island and either visit the Blue Grotto (it's an expensive 5mins inside, but worth it) or take a small boat trip around the island for a full 360 view of it - stop at Marina Piccolo for a swim too. I'm a fan or the restaurant L'Approdo which is in the "unfashionable" Marina Grande, so not even up the hill, but it's good affordable food while you watch the boats come and go. Pompei & Herculaneum - both are great historical sights and worth visiting, but Herculaneum is more for the complete Vesuvius enthusiast (hey, I'm a poet!). Solfatara - one for the adverturers, this is an old thermal spa area located on the coast near Pozzuoli and Naples and known as the Pozzuoli Solfatara. It’s actually the collapsed volcanic crater (caldera) of Solfatara and centuries ago was referred to as the "mouth of hell", most likely for the steam pouring out of craters as much for the smell (rotten eggs all round!).

Sicily
The whole island is great, but highlights include the original town of Siracusa (across the bridge from the main section), climbing Mt Enta (while it was gurgling...I was with a group of geologists, how could I not go?!!), sitting in the Amphitheatre of Taormina looking at Mt Etna and the sea, the temples in Agrigento, Piazza Amerina baths and mosaics, and of course the food and the people.

Venice
If it's really hot, or conversely really cold, when you're there, slip into the foyer cafe of Hotel Danieli and order a coffee/prosecco to enjoy whilst sitting in the comfortable chairs. It's a lovely setting to relax a little, but it's certainly not cheap. Wander in areas like Dosoduro, Castello or Cannaregio for quieter streets and cheaper restaurants/tratorrie. If you're an Indiana Jones fan, you can visit the church in Piazza San Barnaba that doubled as a library in The Last Crusade. Catch a Vaporetto over to Giudecca for an alternative view of St Mark's, or travel to one of the other islands on the lagoon, Burano, to wander the small streets on canals with pastel-coloured houses (although this can get busy as it's the "lace island" too).

Lake Como
Lago di Como is gorgeous, but just a point to consider - the town of Como that gives the lake its common name isn't actually on the lake, so stay in one of the towns that are on the lake such as Tremezzo and Menaggio on the western side and Varenna on the eastern side. Bellagio is on the penninsula that juts out opposite Tremezzo and can be easily reached by a 10min boat ride.

Lake Garda
Great towns all over this large lake north of Verona, including Riva del Garda (north-west), Torbole (north) or Sirmione (south).

Hopefully that gives you some ideas to work with. Keep us posted on your itinerary as it takes shape.

[Eagle]

Jennifer, this looks like a fairly "high end" cooking school, but have a look at www.divinacucina.com/code/meetjudy.html to see if it might interest you.

Cheers!

[jennifer]

Eagle :

THanks! Well, i'm not a huge museum type but it doesn't mean I don't go to the ones you shouldn't miss. No worries, the biggies won't be missed.

We have the possibility to stay in Genoa with friends, so we'll be travelling around there for a while. Probably a few days in Cinque Terre. 4 days in Venice. 4-5 days in Florence. A day in Pisa. Then we'll head who knows where according to what we feel like doing. Maybe rent a place for a week in Tuscany. 5 days in Rome, most likely. It's still kind of unclear.

My mom is entirely relying on me for this. She will research a little, we'll sit down, have chats, utimately decide together, but she's relying on my travel experience and good planning as she has never travelled before (at least out of North America).

Right now I have 2 Lonely Planets i'm reading.

My mom will be comfortable in a hostel, she's not 50 yet, so she's very active and she wants to rough it as a backpacker, just maybe no running from one place to another all the time, just seeing the sights and relaxing, but as a backpacker.

10 months from retirement! Wow, congrats!

Thanks alot!

[jennifer]

Ciao Madam!
I’ve always wanted to see Italy, but felt it was cheating it by going only a few days to Rome or to Venice. I wanted to spend more time there, so here it comes !
I’ll be travelling september to november, so low season. I still have to check what is open or not and plan around that too, but i think the main things are still open.
Florence
I’ll check out the schools you mentionned. I don’t think we'll go for languages classes. I have night classes this semester and the next, just for the fun of learning a little italian, at least enough to get around.
You’re a real bible of info !
I definetely will see at least the Uffizi and Accademia, or at least one of them according to what will happen. I’ll check out the cities you mentionned too. I had already planned to see Pisa and Siena.

Rome
In the region: Civita di Bagnoreggio - Eagle's favourite so I'll let him give the recommendations
Can’t wait to hear from Eagle on that !

Amalfi Coast
Sorrento – It was planned, but probably after on my own as my mom will leave after a month.
Solfatara – So what was great about this place? lol

Thanks so much !

[jennifer]

Eagle, sounds like a great school but I sure can't pay the price...

[Eagle]

jennifer, as this is your Mom's first trip outside North America, I'm sure Italy will be really interesting for her! Be sure to let her know that "things will be different" - for example, NO free refills of Coffee!

In addition to the Lonely Planet Guidebooks, you might want to check Rick Steves Italy 2008 (my favourite!). There's a wealth of information there on great attractions in each city, places to stay & eat, transportation to and within cities and also the opening and closing times of various Museums, etc. One of the big advantages is that the books are updated every year (although there's a "lag time" of several months during printing, so there could still be occasional "dated" information).

If you have PBS in your area, your Mom might enjoy watching RS Travels in Europe. I find that it really helps with the anticipation of trips, to actually see the places I'll be visiting. It's also fun to watch the shows when I get back (even the re-runs) and remember being in each of those places.

If you're planning on visiting Civita di Bagnoregio, you might want to stop for a couple of days in Orvieto (I'd probably drop one day in Venice - 3 days should be enough?). Hopefully MTH will see this post so that she can provide more complete information on the "tablecloth Church" (it's very impressive, especially the frescoes on the ceiling in the small room at the end, near the altar!). Orvieto is a good "home base" for a day trip to Civita. If you're going to stop there, I'll provide more information.

If you have time when you're in Rome, you might want to have a look around Trastevere. It's a very unique area, and during the evenings the sidestreets are a bustle of activity, with small restaurants, etc. The Santa Maria in Trastevere Church is beautiful! I stayed in that area for the first time when I was in Rome this spring, and really enjoyed the experience.

Regarding northern Italy, my choice would be to drop Pisa and spend a couple of days on Lago di Como (the small town of Varenna is only an hour from Milano by train). It's a wonderful spot to just relax and enjoy Italy, and perhaps take a day trip to the elegant town of Bellagio (only about 20 minutes from Varenna). If your Mom likes horticulture, have a look around the beautiful gardens at the "old world" Villa Cipressi and Villa Monastero.

Regarding the Amalfi Coast, Sorrento is relatively easy to reach from Napoli on the Circumvesuviana, but Positano takes a bit more work. There are some other interesting towns in that area, including Amalfi and Ravello. In addition to Capri, there's also Ischia and Procida (I don't think you'll have time for all those however). If you're planning to visit Capri, bring money - it's expensive (but beautiful)!!! The Archeological Museum in Napoli is well worth a visit, but would take some planning if you were only going to be there for a day.

There's SO MUCH to see and do in Italy - where to begin!!!

Yes, retirement is only about 10 months away (Sept. 2009). My big worry is that I won't have enough money to travel after I retire. I guess we'll see?

[jennifer]

Wow, thanks for all this info. And I'll be visiting Positano for sure if I get down there, as I love "under the Tuscan sun"... i know i know

Eagle, you'll always have enough money to travel if you intend it that way. Eat macaroni and cheese if you have to, but don't skip travelling

[madamtrashheap]

Nov 1, 2008 15:18:39 GMT -5 jennifer said:

Florence
I’ll check out the schools you mentionned. I don’t think we'll go for languages classes. I have night classes this semester and the next, just for the fun of learning a little italian, at least enough to get around.

Hey jennifer, didn't mean for you to do a language course at ABC, just check out their cooking classes if you're still interested in doing one of those while your there. Although time in a villa somewhere in Tuscany is a great option too, and you can practise cooking there after you've been to the local markets - just cook whatever looks good!

Orvieto, the town Eagle metioned (thanks Eagle, there are so many places to mention that I overlook some good ones!), is on the regional train line between Rome and Florence, so if you want to visit, don't take the Eurostar Italia on that section. It's a very pretty medieval hilltop town that is dominated by the "tablecloth" Duomo (cathedral) that is perched on the edge looking out over the Umbrian countryside. The reason I call it a tablecloth is that the blue-grey basalt and white travertine horizontal stripes on the outside of the cathedral resemble, to me anyway, a striped picnic tablecloth. The inside is just as impressive and when you take the funicular from the train station to the top of town, there is a small orange bus service that drops right in front of the Duomo, so you can't miss it. It's also a great place to wander the small cobblestoned streets, sample the local Orvieto Classico wine (white is the most popular, but there is also a red) and check out the Well which has 248 steps on each of the double helix staircases inside.

Oh and Solfatara....just threw it in for something different! I liked it, but then it's off the beaten track and smell-o-rama so not for everyone.

Can I also throw Verona (overnight or for a few hours), Bologna (food! Oh and quite a cool town too) and Assisi (amazing cathedrals and frescoes) into the equation.Are you thinking of visiting anywhere on the east coast apart from Venice? As you'll be travelling in the Autumn months, I'm not recommending places like Rimini and Ravenna as they are more suited to Summer months, unless you're wanting to visit the multitude of World Heritage sights in Ravenna instead.

[WillTravel]

You can get into the Italian mood by watching some videos here (this is one particular one, but there are links to some other videos):
www.geobeats.com/videoclips/italy/florence/chiaroscuro-cafe

[Eagle]

MTH, thanks for reminding me of St. Patrick's Well in Orvieto and the double helix stairway. I forgot to mention that. There's also the Underground Tour, which I found quite interesting (especially the reason behind the pigeon lofts).

Thanks also for reminding me of the Orvieto Classico. Note to self - head to the Liquor store tomorrow to pick up a bottle!!! I found a really nice restaurant there also, but would have to check my notes for the name. It was a bit "pricey", but a great meal!

I'd certainly recommend Verona also! I was there in May and really enjoyed my time there. One of these years, I'd like to return there during Opera season. I was able to watch a dress rehearsal of Aida this time, but it's not the same as seeing the full production.

Cheers!

[madamtrashheap]

Nov 3, 2008 4:08:34 GMT -5 Eagle said:

Thanks also for reminding me of the Orvieto Classico. Note to self - head to the Liquor store tomorrow to pick up a bottle!!!

Right there with you Eagle!

The opera season in Verona is amazing - sent friends of mine there this Summer and they saw Tosca, which they loved, so we have more "converts". I love that the Arena will, on different nights, have Tosca, Aida, Muse, Turandot, R.E.M., Carmen....such a mix!

[jennifer]

How will I survive waiting till then? Thanks for all your comments, i'm making a spreadsheet with everything I find, then in a while we'll sit down and decide what to do