anyone know cost of train ticket from Munich to Sa

[abfab]

I am still planning details of trip to Munich in January and need to know what the general cost is for a r/t train ticket to Salzburg. Also, anyone stayed at the Creatif hotel Elephant in Munich? Thanks all!

[nitsansh]

There is no such thing as general cost of trains...
It depend on so many factors...
What type of train and what class? (or type of accomodation in case of night train)
How many people are travelling and how old are they?
What is the date and time of travel?
When and where you buy the ticket?
Also, it depend on what are your travel plans before and after this trip (at least 2 months on both sides), because you might combine this journey with other trips on the same ticket...
So there's no simple answer to your seemingly simple question... because it's not as simple as it looks...
Travel by train in Europe is no different than air travel these days...
Anyway, this trip is too short to make or break anyone's budget...

[nitsansh]

At this moment, no fares are available online for trains in Germany after December 15th, since the new fare structure has not been added to the database.
In the new fare system, you'll get 40% discount if you buy tickets more than 14 days ahead.

[nitsansh]

OK... I read your earlier posts so I know a bit more...

I understand that you and your daughter (she is 18, you are obviousely over 26...) are flying to Roma via Munchen and you stop in Munchen on the return leg for 5 days between Jan 7-12... during this 5-days stopover you wish to make excursions to the castles near Fussen and Salzburg...
am I right so far?

Well... the standart adult 2nd class one-way price for Munchen-Salzburg by train is 21 Euro. You pay 3.6 Euro for EC trains supplement (the difference in time is just about 20 minutes, so no need for that IMO). Standart return ticket is therefor 42 Euro.
If you make a day return trip on Saturday or Sunday, the "Happy Weekend" fare applies, and you can both travel the whole day for just 28 Euro on local trains.
Also, the Lander (state) day ticket might apply...

These are the fares until December 14th... after that everything could change... Wait further 9 days and we'll be smarter...

Whatever the price, my advice is to go to a train station or travel agency as soon as you get to Europe and ask what is the best fare for you...

[abfab]

Thanks for the information. I was looking at the day trips offered from tour groups from Munich to Salzburg, they charge $41.00 per person for the whole 10-12 hour excursion and I didn't know if that was a good deal. I didn't want to get over there and find the tickets to be $120.00 for the train only. Thanks for all your help and input. I'll keep ya' posted!

[nitsansh]

Details of the new German price system is here:
www.bahn.de/pv/int_guest/offers/die_bahn_plan_save_overview.shtml
I must correct my earlier remark... the 40% discount requires only 7-days advanced purchase, but it also requires Saturday night stay. There's 25% discount if you buy tickets 3-days ahead (no Saturday stay required), and 10% discount if you buy the day before travel. The 25 and 40% are only available for return tickets.
There is also a 50% reduction for 2-5 people who travel together. As I understand it, the 1st person pay full price and the others pay 50%.
Those two offers are cumulative, so 2 people that travel together and qualify for the 40% APEX discount would have 55% discount! And if you use the 25% APEX and travel together discounts the total is 44% reduction!

This is what I mean that cost of train travel isn't a simple question...

[nitsansh]

Just curious... how long is your stopover in Munchen on the outward leg? If you have even 1-hour interval, go to the tourist information office at the airport, pick up brochurs and ask about excursions... I guess there is more than one offer for trips to Salzburg and the Konigschlosser (Kings castles near Fussen - there are 3 if you include Linderhof).
Since the castles are hard to get to by public transport, I think you would be better off with a tour there, but there's no such problem for Salzburg, if you only visit the city...
If you decide against organized trip to Salzburg - you still have time to benefit from the 25% APEX discount when you arrive to Munchen again. If my calculation is correct, and the standart price stay the same, a return ticket to Salzburg should cost 47E for two. Or if you can enjoy the Happy Weekend fare, the price is only 28E for two! Or the Lander one-day fare for only 21E! I'm not sure, though, if these offers will stay when the new fares commence...
As I previousely said, we will be smarter on December 15th... or even earlier, if the Germans enter the data...

BTW... did you consider the option of car rental? It's quite cheap in Germany... class A should cost about 25E per day... petrol cost around 1E per liter, so I estimate the cost of petrol for the 300KM return trip to Salzburg at 20-30E... there are no toll roads to worry about in Germany as far as I know, and no speed limit on the highways... Germany is drivers paradise...

[nitsansh]

As far as one-day train trips are concerned, the Bayern Lander ticket is the best deal... (if it still exist after Dec 15)
It cost 21E for up to 5 people travelling together, and good for unlimited travel in 2nd class within Bayern on local and regional trains (IRE, RE, RB, SE and S-Bahn) on weekdays (Mon-Fri) from 9AM to 3AM (the next day) and apparently all day weekends and holidays. This ticket is also valid on Munchen urban transportation (trams, buses and underground).
Note: Since Salzburg is outside Bayern, the ticket may be valid only till the last stop before the border.

[LHR02]

I have to second Nitsansh's thought about getting an 'organized' day tour for Neuschweinstein et al. Yep, you can do it with train/bus but he is right, they are somewhat out of the way and takes a bit of planning and transfers to get there and back. Normally these day tour trips are quite reasonably priced, get you there and back with few hassles, offer some information and entertainment along the way and are worth investigating. A search on any Munich home page should have a section on tours that will give you an idea of what is available and prices. I'd at least check them out as an option worth considering.

Also, his suggestion of a rental is another worth giving thought to. Lived in Germany for 6 years, can promise you driving is not a problem at all as long as you stay out of the left lane (grin) and roads are clearly marked and easy to follow. However, you might want to avoid picking up a car in downtown Munich and trying to get out of town at rush hour! As would be true in any city unknown to you.

As one who certainly appreciates your desire for 'independant' travel, I love it myself, I have to also add that I have availed myself of day tours many times and found them an easier alternative than trying to make it all work on my own. And it is just a 'day' tour after all.....so you are not really giving up much of your independance!

ging

[nitsansh]

I did some further research...
I found that there is fairly good connection by bus from Fussen to Hohenschwangau - that's one of the Kings Palaces, which was built by Ludwig II's predecessor, Maximilian II. But I found no transportation to the other 2 palaces, which Ludwig himself built. Well... that doesn't mean necessarily it doesn't exist, but I can't guaranty you... I also believe there are organized trips to the castles from Fuessen, but I see no point in getting to Fuessen by train and taking a tour from there... also bear in mind that access to the palaces is only by guided tours... if you were going there in high season, it was worth taking a tour if only to avoid the lines... organized groups allways get priority over indepent travellers in these cases...

As to the option of car rental... I found an offer of 124 Euro for 3-days rental - that's usually the minimum - but I believe there should be better offers than this...
If you have a car you are free to choose your itinerary, your timetable, your accomodation - actually everything, as long as it's near a road... and the price, including fuel, tolls, parking etc shouldn't be more than 200 Euro (depending on the distance you travel).
Obviousely, you don't need a car while you visit a major town like Munchen...
If you hire a car, you can not only visit Salzburg and the Konigschlosser, but a lot more in 3 days... and you can find relatively cheap accomodation in Zimmers (rooms in private houses) in small towns and villages along the way... just avoid the pricy skiing resorts where they charge high season prices at this time of year...
Be aware of the weather forcast and road condition... if the weather is bad, roads might be dangerous...
Most car rental companies have pick-up and drop-off locations at Munchen airport and at least one in the city... rental in airports is usually more expensive by 10-15%, but most people prefer it for the convenience...

[LHR02]

>>>>>>>>I found that there is fairly good connection by bus from Fussen to Hohenschwangau - that's one of the Kings Palaces, which was built by Ludwig II's predecessor, Maximilian II. But I found no transportation to the other 2 palaces, which Ludwig himself built.<<<<<<

Neuschweinstein is quite literally 'across the street' from Hohenschwangau! A stone's throw, you walk between the two in 5-10 minutes, if that. But, one is 'in town' and the other on top of the hill so while as the crow flies it is 2 minutes, on foot can take a while. Linderhof is actually in Austria if memory serves, just across the border. About a 30 minute drive over some winding 2 lane roads, but very well marked and easy to find. Not sure about public transport from Fussen to Linderhof, although certain it must be available.....not sure in January time frame though. As I said in prior post, Linderhof is by far the most impressive of the lot, albeit probably the most difficult to get to. BTW, Ludwig was born and raised in Hohenschwangau and his mother lived there till her death. (Everyone who ever came to visit in the 6 years we lived there wanted to see these places so I've been there many times! As for the road conditions, have driven down there when the snow was piled so high on the sides of the road you couldn't see over it, but roadway was always cleared and at best simply 'wet'.....the Germans really know how to take care of their roads!

ging

[LHR02]

A quick search found this on Frommers site.....

>>>>>>If you want to visit King Ludwig's famous castles, there's a 10 1/2-hour tour to Neuschwanstein and Linderhof costing 78DM ($39). <<<<<

It is with Panaroma Tours, a division of Gray Line tours. I am sure there are others, just was checking to see if you could get a 'tour' that would get you to both castles for a reasonable price. ;D

ging

[nitsansh]

DOM:
Do you think it is possible to see all 3 castles in that area on one day tour? If not, which one would you leave out? Sounds like Hohenschwangau is the least impressive...

Are you familiar with King Ludwig's 3rd castle-palace, the one on the island at Chimsee? Which is said to be a copy of Chateau Versailles near Paris, and quite a good one...

If abfac and her daughter rent for 3 days, what itinerary would you suggest?

BTW, Schloss Linderhof is definately in Germany, but these days with Euro and Schengen borders have no practical function as far as tourists are concerned... just watch out that a toll sticker is needed in highways in Austria, and that they do have speed limit... only in Germany freeway means exactly that....

[nitsansh]

Please note the castles' opening times and prices in winter:
(source: Michelin guide Germany 2001)

Neuschwanstein: Guided tour 35 minutes, 10AM-4PM, 12 DM (now probably 7 Euro).
Hohenschwangau: Guided tour 30 minutes 10AM-4.30PM, also 12DM.
Linderhof: Guided tour 45 minutes, 9AM-noon, 1-4PM, 7DM (4 EURO)
Giving the short opening times (in summer typical opening times 9-5), it seems almost impossible to see all 3 castles in one day tour.
But if you have a car and stay in nearby village, you can see 1 castle in one day (say Linderhof) and the other 2 on a 2nd day...
Chimsee: 15 minutes by boat from Prien-Stock to Herreninsel (men's island, another one is called Fraueninsel - women's island), fare 10DM (6E) return. Schloss Herrenchimsee: Guided tour 35 minutes, 9.30AM-4PM, 8DM (5E). Well... the combined price of boat and tour makes this the most expensive castle...
Chimsee (lake Chim) is near Munich-Salzburg highway. If you have a car, you can easily visit this lake and its island and castle en-route to Salzburg. AKA "the Bavarian sea", this lake is a popular holiday resort in summer... I believe there aren't any holiday makers in January... If you have spare time, you could take the minor roads on the north side of the lake. The highway is on the south side. Prien, from which the boat to the island sail, is on the west side.
I haven't checked that, but I believe the trains on Munich-Salzburg line also stop at Prein, so getting there by train should not be a problem... just a matter of less flexibility... trains travel on this route at least once an hour...

[LHR02]

>>>>>BTW, Schloss Linderhof is definately in Germany, but these days with Euro and Schengen borders have no practical function as far as tourists are concerned... <<<<

Absolutely right.....as soon as I read your post I remembered...the easiest, fastest way to drive there is to cross into Austria, then back into Germany. It's the most direct route there, believe it or not. ;D

>>>>>Do you think it is possible to see all 3 castles in that area on one day tour? If not, which one would you leave out? Sounds like Hohenschwangau is the least impressive...<<<<<

Very doable indeed, have done it many times. Even on the above mentioned tour it should be easy to see them all as the two are so close to each other. Hohenschwangau is the 'oldest' and most basic of the three, but unlike Neuschweinstein which is for the most part unfinished and devoid of furnishings and decorations, Hohenschwangau as the family home is fully done up still interior wise. However, it is/was a 'normal' castle, nothing like Ludwig's mammoth things.

>>>>>>>>Are you familiar with King Ludwig's 3rd castle-palace, the one on the island at Chimsee? Which is said to be a copy of Chateau Versailles near Paris, and quite a good one...<<<<<<

Herrenchimsee....fabulous! And can also be done in one day if you have a car. It is on the way back to Munich, if you take a just slightly out of the way route. I have indeed done all of them in one day, BUT in the summer. And it is a long day indeed. Hours are much reduced as you know in January, so doubt if all could be done the same day then. AND...for what it is worth, Herrenchimsee, while beautiful anytime, really loses so much in the winter. The gardens are bare, the fountains and statues boxed/crated up and it is colder than hell in that place! Of course, the same can be said of Linderhof which likewise has wonderful gardens. But the interior of Linderhof is so drop dead amazing that it still remains the MUST SEE of them all, IMHO.

Route for three day rental.....depends on does that include Salzburg or just Bavaria. If they think they might want to go the rental way I'll get some ideas together. BTW, if they had a rental it would be easier still to see Andechs.

ging